Pretty Much Here Exploring Vehicle Options for Rich
Good morning, this is me and it’s been a very nice Saturday morning. I’ve been with Rich for about 2 hours of watching fishy shows. I think he appreciated the company and I’m on my plan to start learning stuff. I want to be appreciating this new world. I don’t think it’s going away and I know it makes our fishyman happy. I think we’ve seen bits and parts of 7-8 shows. He skips past the commercials and repeats so it’s going fast. There are a lot of fishy shows he’s saved. He really went out looking for them. It does my heart good to see him so happy.But, now he’s turned on quietly CNN while he’s making a few phone calls. He is looking at his list and thinking that going through the manila envelope that came with his boat is just one of the things he has to do. He also has a load of clothes he just brought down to the laundry. It was full when he checked it before. I think he’s got two loads, maybe three, but he said he can do some tomorrow too if it gets busy.
I think he’s going to play cards again today. He’s been playing in some kinds of tournaments. He should be doing that about 2 pm. I’m going to assume it goes until about 6 pm again, maybe sooner if he loses. I don’t think he’s planning on doing much more. He did give me options so we might suggest trying the bowling again or a movie.
We actually got out yesterday for the bowling, but even though we called it turned out there were going to be leagues at 6 pm, so that only allowed us 45 minutes to bowl which was no good. We sat with Rich out in the car fuming a bit … well more me on that then him, but he was saying we might as well go home to do the ham dinner, but we were thinking we were out and we wanted to be doing something.
What Rich came up with was looking at his new vehicle. I think he’s now within a couple of weeks of getting something. He knows he needs something to haul that boat. He looked at four things over at Honda next to the gym. He peeked at the Accord, but spent more time with the Ridgeline, Pilot and Odyssey
Ok, hello. Good Afternoon. It’s me again. We’ve been out car shopping for Rich.
Was that asked for? Naw – not really. Actually, he left for his cards with us being frustrated at each other. He was looking at those vehicles I just mentioned, but then I spent 3-4 hours looking at cars on-line, and I found it was a much better deal to get a Highlander Hybrid with all the good stuff for $45,000. This already includes the better audio, DVD, rear and duel climate control, moon roof, anti-theft, leathers seats, navigational and a tow package. I also found out that his Accord is about $6000 for trade-in. So, we figured if he put $5000 down he could finance $34,000 for 5 years at 6.35% for a monthly payment of $663.
Now, is that what he was looking for? I’m not sure, but we’re figuring its pretty damn close as to options. The price I assume he would have to check out and obviously try to whittle things down. It would be questionable if his car could get that much, but it’s the Kelly Blue Book value. He could get much more, but there are a lot of miles on the car. They have two cars coming in with these qualifications. I didn’t get the colors, but most of their colors have the grey which would be our best pick as to going with the red boat. The gas mile difference is where the real choices are made. The other vehicles were 17/22 where the Highlander Hybrid is about 27/25.
It’s very frustrating with Rich because he wanted to say that it was too expensive before he knew any hard prices. He was saying that the Highlander was $7000 more than the Odyssey
Hmm, I pulled together a package deal for the 2009 Odyssey. We added to the Navigational and DVD Entertainment System – auto transmission $859 for trailer set-up, $138 moon-roof visor, $508 back-up sensors, $509 hands-free phone, $77 table leg kit, $209 cross bars, $219 Wood dashboard trim and $209 floor mats for a total cost (including destination and handling $670) of $40,354.
So Rich was close to right, but not exactly. He kept insisting $7000 difference, but in reality it’s closer to $5000 difference. The one major difference is that one is a van and the other is a SUV … we believe the SUV pulls better and drives better, especially with a boat AND there is a difference of 10 mpg in the city with the Highlander being the favored vehicle. Plus, it’s going to cost extra money for when towing, so at that point getting the better gas mileage is going to be really important.
180,000 miles which is what his current car is at after 4 years at 17 mpg is 10,588 gallons and the same at 27 mpg is 6,666 gallons. If gas was to cost $3.00 and the difference in cars is 3,922 gallons, then he would save $11,766 with the Highlander AND he would be much more environmentally friendly.
HMPF … It would be fair enough at least for him to listen!
Ok, we did a little more we add these two entries to the package.
Looking at the 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid
Summary
What Edmunds.com says
The 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid is an ideal choice for shoppers wanting a vehicle that offers high fuel economy and seven-passenger practicality.
Pros
Hybrid power-train provides ample power and high fuel economy, excellent cabin design and materials, versatile second-row seating.
Cons
Third-row seats fold as one piece rather than in split sections, not suitable for off-road or serious winter duties.
What's New for 2009
After a complete redesign last year, the 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid remains unchanged.
2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid Vehicle Overview
Introduction
There's no denying that most hybrid passenger cars save on fuel costs. A side benefit is the feeling that you're helping to reduce our oil dependence and pollution output. But hybrids SUVs are more of a mixed bag. While these vehicles may sport "Hybrid" badges that give their owners the warm green fuzzies, they often offer only marginal environmental improvements over their conventionally powered counterparts.
Such is not the case with the 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid, which genuinely boasts the best of both worlds. Although it's a fairly large crossover SUV, the Highlander Hybrid turns in a very respectable 26 mpg in the EPA's combined fuel economy estimate, which is 6-7 mpg better than the conventional V6-powered Highlander. Yet this superior fuel economy doesn't come at the expense of power. The V6 and electric motor combo provides remarkably brisk and seamless acceleration. At the same time, the Highlander offers the same advantages as the regular Highlander, including an attractively designed and versatile cabin with comfortable seating for up to seven passengers.
This all-around excellence helps the Highlander stand out from other competitors, hybrid or otherwise. This isn't to say there aren't drawbacks, however. Even in base form, the Highlander Hybrid is more expensive than the loaded-up Limited variant of the regular Highlander. And although the Highlander is all-wheel drive, we don't think the Hybrid's AWD is as effective as a more traditional AWD setup. Still, for crossover shoppers with environmental leanings looking for a seven-passenger vehicle, Toyota proves there can be only one -- the Highlander Hybrid.
For Pricing information, see our Pricing page.
Body Styles, Trim Levels, and Options
The 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid is a midsize crossover SUV that is offered in base and Limited trim levels. The base model seats five passengers and comes standard with 17-inch alloy wheels, an eight-way manually adjustable driver seat, a tilt and telescoping steering wheel with audio controls, air-conditioning, a six-speaker sound system with a CD/MP3 player and an auxiliary audio jack, full power accessories, keyless ignition and entry and a multifunction display with a back-up camera.
The Highlander Limited adds 19-inch alloy wheels, a power rear lift-gate, an in-dash six-CD changer, satellite radio, leather seats, heated and power-adjustable front seats, and third-row seating for two more passengers. Many of these features are available as optional add-ons for the base model.
Options for either trim level include dual-zone automatic climate control, rear automatic climate control and a separate rear air-conditioning unit. Further enhancements can be added to the Limited model and include a sunroof, a nine-speaker JBL sound system with Bluetooth, a voice-activated navigation system and a rear-seat entertainment system.
For more Style information, see our Compare Styles page.
Power-trains and Performance
The 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid's starting point is a 3.3-liter V6 gasoline engine that cranks out 209 horsepower. It's matched to a pair of electric motors, one of which is primarily used as a starter/generator. Peak power for the gasoline-electric combo is a healthy 270 hp, and it's routed to the front wheels through a specialized continuously variable transmission (CVT).
The Hybrid does have an AWD system in which a third electric motor is used to drive the rear wheels when extra traction or torque is needed. However, this setup differs significantly from the 4WD/all-wheel-drive system on the regular Highlander. There's no center differential, and the V6 engine never provides power to the rear wheels. As such, the Hybrid isn't really meant to go off-road, and even buyers shopping for a serious snow vehicle may not find it robust enough to meet their needs.
In our tests, we managed to hustle the Highlander Hybrid to 60 mph in only 7.5 seconds. That's quick for any seven-passenger SUV, regardless of power-train type. Fuel economy comes in at an EPA-rated 27 mpg city/25 mpg highway and 26 mpg in combined driving. City mileage is slightly higher than highway mileage because the Highlander relies more on the electric motors for propulsion at low speeds.
For more Performance Data, see our Specifications page.
Safety
The 2009 Highlander Hybrid comes standard with antilock disc brakes with brake assist, stability control, traction control, hill start assist, front-seat side airbags, side curtain airbags for all three seating rows, driver knee airbags and a back-up camera.
In government crash testing, the Highlander Hybrid scored a perfect five stars for driver protection in frontal impacts, while front passenger protection garnered four stars. Side-impact protection earned another five stars for both front and rear occupants. The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety awarded the Highlander Hybrid its highest score of "Good" for frontal-offset and side-impact protection.
For more Safety information, see our Safety page.
Interior Design and Special Features
The 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid's cabin is a pleasant place to be. We're particularly fond of the hideaway center seat in the second row. When you don't have a middle passenger in the second row, this seat stows in the back of the front console, and you can snap down a table with cup-holders. Alternatively, you can leave this space open so older kids can access the optional third row without forcing you to move and reinstall any car seats that might be in the second-row outboard positions.
The third-row bench can seat adults in a pinch, but it's certainly not as roomy as some third-row seats in other large crossovers. The Highlander's third row is also a one-piece fixed design, so you can't configure the cargo area for a storage and passenger mix. However, the seat does fold flat into the floor, allowing for 42 cubic feet of cargo space behind the second row. With the second row folded down, the space opens up to a capacious 94 cubes.
For more Interior Features information, see our Specifications page.
Driving Impressions
The 2009 Toyota Highlander Hybrid's ride is comfortable and hushed. Handling is competent and sure-footed but certainly not sporty. What is sporty, though, is the acceleration when the gas and electric motors are both laying down the power. In normal driving, the transition from electric to gasoline power is seamless. The Highlander Hybrid also feels relatively maneuverable, especially when compared with the competing Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid.
In the interest of maximizing fuel economy, the driver can select either "EV" or "Econ" driving mode. In EV mode, the vehicle is motivated solely by electric power, but only at very low speeds for short distances. More useful is Econ mode, which restrains throttle response for the benefit of fuel economy. Switch it on in stop-and-go traffic and you'll never miss the extra power.
Looking at the Honda Odyssey
Summary
What Edmunds.com says
Though scheduled for a complete redesign next year, the 2009 Honda Odyssey remains our favorite choice in the minivan segment.
Pros
Agile handling, convenient split and flat-folding rear bench seat, available eight-passenger capacity, excellent crash-test scores.
Cons
Elevated road noise, suspension isn't as cushy as that of some competitors.
What's New for 2009
After a significant face-lift last year, the only change for the 2009 Honda Odyssey is an updated EX-L trim level. A power lift-gate is now standard on this model, and the EX-L's optional navigation system gains integrated Bluetooth technology.
2009 Honda Odyssey Vehicle Overview
Introduction
Having evolved extensively over the past 15 years to meet the changing demands and tastes of minivan shoppers, the Honda Odyssey minivan rolls into 2009 with few significant changes. We're sure this will be just fine with the Odyssey's target demographic, as Honda's minivan is a classic case of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Put simply, if you're assembling a short list of minivans to consider, the Honda Odyssey should be on it.
It's easy to see why the Honda Odyssey family van has garnered more "Edmunds Most Wanted" awards than any other minivan. While any contemporary van can serve as a competent people mover, none can match the Odyssey's killer combination of refinement and responsiveness on the road. This is one family hauler in which driving enjoyment and pride of ownership don't take a backseat to day-in, day-out practicality.
Although there are more choices than ever before in the family utility segment, including traditional rivals like the Toyota Sienna and a growing number of three-row crossover SUVs like the Mazda CX-9, the 2009 Honda Odyssey remains at the top of our people-mover list. Its spaciousness and hauling capability leave crossovers in the dust, and it bests most other minivans in terms of style, drivability and overall execution. It's what a big family vehicle should be.
For pricing information, see our Pricing page.
Body Styles, Trim Levels, and Options
The midsize 2009 Honda Odyssey minivan is available in four trim levels: LX, EX, EX-L and Touring. The base LX model comes standard with dual manual sliding rear doors, keyless entry, full power accessories, cruise control, dual-zone air-conditioning, a tilt and telescoping steering wheel and a four-speaker AM/FM/CD stereo with MP3 compatibility and an auxiliary audio jack. The EX trim level adds alloy wheels, power-sliding rear doors, a power driver seat, automatic triple-zone climate control and a six-speaker audio system with an in-dash six-CD changer. The luxurious EX-L provides a leather-trimmed interior, heated front seats, a power front passenger seat, a power lift-gate, a back-up camera with a rearview-mirror-mounted display, satellite radio and a sunroof. Optional on the EX-L are a rear DVD entertainment system and a navigation system with Bluetooth and an integrated back-up camera display. For those with fatter wallets who desire the ultimate Honda Odyssey, the Touring edition adds run-flat tires, rear parking sensors, power-adjustable pedals, driver memory positioning and a premium audio system.
For more Style information, see our Compare Styles page.
Power-trains and Performance
The 2009 Honda Odyssey is powered by a 3.5-liter V6 that drives the front wheels through a five-speed automatic transmission. On lower-level LX and EX trims, this engine produces 244 horsepower and 240 pound-feet of torque. For upscale EX-L and Touring models, it's engineered with a fuel-saving cylinder deactivation feature called Variable Cylinder Management (VCM). Compared to last year's, newly revised figures raise power levels to a similar 244 horses and 245 lb-ft of torque. With this more sophisticated power plant that can deactivate two or three of the engine's six cylinders under cruising conditions, the 2009 Honda Odyssey returns EPA-estimated fuel economy of 17 mpg city/25 mpg highway and 20 mpg combined, while the base engine is rated at 16/23/18. In performance testing, we've clocked a Touring model from zero to 60 mph in a respectable 8.7 seconds.
For more Performance Data, see our Specifications page.
Safety
Standard safety features on the 2009 Honda Odyssey include antilock disc brakes with brake assist, stability control, active front head restraints, front-seat side-impact airbags and full-length head curtain airbags with a rollover sensor. For touring models, Honda offers Michelin PAX System run-flat tires that can be driven for more than 100 miles when punctured. Note, however, that PAX System tires typically cannot be repaired when damaged, and replacement tires are quite expensive and may be difficult to find.
The Odyssey earned a perfect five-star rating in government front- and side-impact crash tests. Insurance Institute for Highway Safety test results are equally impressive: Honda's minivan earned a best-possible "Good" rating for both frontal-offset and side-impact collisions.
For more Safety information, see our Safety page.
Interior Design and Special Features
The Odyssey can seat seven or eight passengers, with the maximum number of chairs made possible by a stowable center seat in the second row on EX, EX-L and Touring models. This optional seat can be converted into a tray table or removed and stored in the Odyssey's in-floor storage area. For added versatility, the second-row captain's chairs can be brought together to form a two-passenger bench. Out back, there's a fold-flat 60/40-split bench seat in the third row that seats three. With this seat stowed away, the Odyssey provides more than 91 cubic feet of cargo volume behind its second-row seats. This number increases to just over 147 cubic feet when the second-row chairs are removed, about average for this segment but significantly more than any crossover SUVs.
For more Interior Features information, see our Specifications page.
Driving Impressions
The 2009 Honda Odyssey remains the most carlike minivan currently available, thanks to responsive steering, athletic suspension calibration and a tight turning radius. However, smaller families on a budget and those not needing to haul around extra passengers and cargo might want to consider a trimmer and more maneuverable compact carry-all like the Mazda 5 or Kia Rondo. At speed, either Honda V6 provides good acceleration, but the Odyssey's interior noise levels and relatively firm ride make it feel less luxurious than the Sienna.
Ok, we’re back OK >>> WE’RE BACK!!!
It’s about 3:30 pm now and we haven’t gotten much further with the day than doing a lot of shopping around. It’s all going to come down to whether Rich wants a van or SUV. I think the SUV has a nicer looking front – more aggressive and truck like, but there are advantages too to having side doors that slide open on either side rather than open/close like a car. Also although there is no question now in my mind that cost and gas wise the Highlander is better than the Odyssey, the Odyssey WITH the 2nd and 3rd row of seats is longer than the Highlander. The Highlander’s max capacity is 94 cubes, but is 270 HP while the Odyssey is 147 cubes and 244 HP. So, those kinds of things have to get worked out as to being a preference. I think Rich is going to like the storage, but the vehicle is more of a nuisance in the city especially to park and it’s just not as strong for towing. I don’t know what happens to the Odyssey, but the towing package for the Highlander is for 5000 pounds. That seems like a better deal because in the long run it’s not going to hurt the car as badly as the Odyssey will.
Ok, Sweetie if you've read this I've had my say ... as long as you are choosing apples to apples and oranges to oranges, it's all your choice. I just wanted you to be less biased. I know you drove Bud's van and it seemed to work better than Bob's van, and somehow that means you’re more excited in that direction, but I think that SUV's will ultimately pull better and drive safer than vans, especially if you read the ratings for both. The Honda has a professional rating of 8.5 ... and a customer rating of 6.4. The Toyota has doesn't have a number for the professional rating, but the customer rating is 9.6. This set of numbers is substantial. Like I said you are going to make the choice, but to not even look at the Highlander is just you being overly stubborn.
posted by Ann Marie @ 1/04/2009 10:12:00 AM
Comments: 0
